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Thread: Standoff in Nevada?

  1. #241
    Senior Member sundancekid's Avatar
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    Again, think we had this exact same discussion over at PI before, and this may not be the proper thread for it either. Perhaps the bubble thread would be better (we can then also track Williams' prediction that we'll see US hyperinflation in 2014...)

    Still, for me his inflation levels are just absurdly high, regardless of methodology used. Do you really think that the US price increases since 1990 differ that much from the other developing economies? The Norwegian price inflation was less than 100% between 1990 and 2013, less than 100% in the UK etc. etc. And we are suddenly to believe that in the US it was almost 500%? Compare a gallon milk or most other basic goods and his figures are simply not believable.

  2. #242
    Super Moderator LivinLOS's Avatar
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    500% ??? His figures dont show that much..

    And yes, every western government does the same substitution game with the figures.

  3. #243
    Senior Member sundancekid's Avatar
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    First off, obviously I’m not going to put down any money to purchase his datasets. But just by eyeballing his charts, you’ll see that the differences since 1990 should be in the 500% ballpark. Others do have access to the dataset however, and if you plug in the numbers into e.g. Tom's Inflation Calculator (not me, by the way...) you’ll get an increase of 540%. (EDIT: Just to be clear, that inflation calculator is provided with the permission of ShadowStats, but cannot display the underlying dataset.)

    I even tried William’s own inflation calculator, but after stacking 7 bars on top of each other, I still could not match the scary green bar…

    shadowstats.jpg
    Last edited by sundancekid; 27th April 2014 at 19:34.

  4. #244
    Senior Member sundancekid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LivinLOS View Post
    And yes, every western government does the same substitution game with the figures.
    I'd like to see some sources of that. I try to follow the Norwegian CPI Indexes at times, and have noticed about a 4% increase since 2010, which seems fair to me. Plot in 2010 - 2013 in the ShadowStats (US) calculator however, and you get a whopping 32% increase. As you claiming that this would be a more accurate inflation rate for Norway as well?

    But again, this is probably not the thread for it...

  5. #245
    Senior Member sundancekid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TLandHim View Post
    CollectskullsThanks for that, the article is the best reporting I have seen of the issue. A must read if you are looking at the incidents
    Back to thread, even though Bundy has gotten way more than his 15 minutes due already…

    BUNDY: There are multiple angles to explain on this topic. What I would like to express more than anything is that the BLM does not own the land. In other words, it is not federal land, it is state land.
    Again, I don’t really care what delusional personal opinions Bundy has, but this is simply factually not correct. End of story.

  6. #246
    Senior Member tnlawyer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LivinLOS View Post
    Yeah OK.. Tho your version of south sort of means more than just being, well you know, on average south

    Is California 'south' ?? But I do get your meaning.
    My South typically refers to the old South....the Confederacy. California is an ok state if you get rid of LA and San Francisco.
    Last edited by tnlawyer; 27th April 2014 at 22:04.

  7. #247
    Senior Member sundancekid's Avatar
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    Even more irony then 555… First we have the welfare cowboy who rants against government subsidies for the negros. And where would the original Confederate States (takers?) be today without the aid from the federal government?


  8. #248
    Super Moderator LivinLOS's Avatar
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    And to play devils advocate.. Excluding oddball states like alaska (how does it cost so much when the state makes so much oil revenue ??) have a think about racial demographics in the creditor / debtor states..

  9. #249
    Senior Member tnlawyer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LivinLOS View Post
    And to play devils advocate.. Excluding oddball states like alaska (how does it cost so much when the state makes so much oil revenue ??) have a think about racial demographics in the creditor / debtor states..
    I'd say that is probably a big part of it.

  10. #250
    Super Moderator LivinLOS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tnlawyer View Post
    I'd say that is probably a big part of it.
    Too easy to do that without looking into the whys tho.. The factors that drive those issues.

  11. #251

  12. #252
    Senior Member sundancekid's Avatar
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    Sorry, but if I didn't know any better I'd think that was pure satire. Talk about a complete mangling of the facts. Even Breitbart has moved away from the Chinese solar link by now...

  13. #253
    Senior Member sundancekid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LivinLOS View Post
    Too easy to do thatwithout looking into the whys tho.. The factors that drive thoseissues.
    Agree. I think as well that the factors are more complex than just labelling the Red states as takers. Was more a tongue in cheek from my part, even though I believe the data is real. But have a sense that factors like farm subsidies and age may be more important than racial demographics.

    Fact is still though that the dependency of the Red states has continued to increase since the 1980s, while the Republican candidates have promised to slash government spending. Whereas states that pay more in taxes than they receive in benefits tend to support Democratic candidates. Surely there is a hint of irony or even hypocrisy in there somewhere…

  14. #254
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    Quote Originally Posted by sundancekid View Post
    Sorry, but if I didn't know any better I'd think that was pure satire. Talk about a complete mangling of the facts. Even Breitbart has moved away from the Chinese solar link by now...
    It's on Fox TV. So what do you think?

  15. #255
    Senior Member sundancekid's Avatar
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    ^ Sure. But even Hannity and Breitbart had started to dial it back when this aired. And Glen Beck wasn't even on board in the first place...

    And the moment that particular troika began putting on the coat… time to reach for the hat as well. But then this “judge” was doubling-tripling-quadrupling down. Even surprising by Fox standards… If that's at all possible.
    Last edited by sundancekid; 29th April 2014 at 00:09.

  16. #256
    Senior Member faultytowers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greatdane View Post
    I think we should be worried. The chance of misuse right now is probably not that big, but we do not know what tomorrow will bring, and if we do not control what data is collected now, those data can be used to sinister purpose in the future.
    It's tomorrow now !

    Microsoft must release email data held on Dublin server

    A judge in the US has ordered Microsoft to hand over a customer's emails, even though the data is held on a server in Ireland.
    Microsoft has previously taken steps to reassure customers that data held on servers abroad should not be subject to search warrants by US authorities.


    The judge said warrants for online data were different to other warrants.


    The search warrant, which was issued to Microsoft by US authorities, sought information associated with a customer's email account including the customer's name, credit card details and contents of all messages.


    Microsoft said that the account was hosted on a server in Dublin and therefore the search warrant was not valid as the data was outside of the US.


    Judge James Francis in New York said that this was true for "traditional" warrants but not for those seeking online content, which are governed by federal law under the Stored Communications Act.
    BBC News - Microsoft must release email data held on Dublin server

    So now we have "different" warrants which bypass the rules covering "traditional" warrants .

  17. #257
    Super Moderator LivinLOS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sundancekid View Post
    This is what I had in mind, which is a shortened version of the discussions TWiT had on the FCC ruling. Although they did have a number of shows on that topic in January. The discussion on net neutrality starts from 49:10. (Just loved Beja’s “rant” and how the term “government regulation” is always viewed as bad in some circles 555.)



    Always enjoyed the TWiT shows though, and even found this link from 2011 featuring self-declared Libertarian and "anti-state, anti-IP views" Kinsella. As per his the mises.org link:



    Kinsella on This Week in Law discussing IP, Net Neutrality

    Ok I know this is an old thread to stick in an off topic video.. But this is too good to pass up.

    billpay likes this.

  18. #258
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    Just an update on the continuing saga.

    Complete acquittal of two and 11-1 jury decision to acquit the other two defendants.

    Acquittal comes despite amazing decisions made by the "judge" re admission of evidence.

    Updated August 22, 2017 - 8:30 pm
    Jurors acquitted two men of charges that could have sent them to federal prison for decades Tuesday, while reaching a split decision for two others, in a retrial that stemmed from the 2014 armed standoff in Bunkerville.
    The four men hugged their attorneys, as about two dozen loyal supporters erupted into cheers from the gallery of a courtroom where they had quietly watched weeks and weeks of testimony.
    Montana resident Ricky Lovelien and Idaho resident Steven Stewart were acquitted of all 10 counts they faced and were expected to be released from custody Tuesday night.
    Stewart cried and nodded his head along with each “not guilty” U.S. District Judge Gloria Navarro read aloud, while Lovelien showed little more emotion than a grin.
    After several supporters stepped outside to line Las Vegas Boulevard and trumpet the verdicts, defense attorneys gathered briefly in a hallway just outside Navarro’s courtroom.
    Stewart’s attorney, Rich Tanasi, said he was thankful to the jury and “ecstatic that my client gets to go home and see his family.”
    Lovelien’s lawyer, Shawn Perez, told reporters that prosecutors had “overcharged” the defendants.
    “I’m real happy for Ricky,” Perez said. “He’s a good guy … It’s an overwhelming feeling. I can’t even tell you.
    “I know he’s looking forward to a steak and a beer. Something.”
    The panel of six women and six men deliberated for a little more than three days. The jury also acquitted Idaho residents Scott Drexler and Eric Parker of most counts but could not agree on all charges against the two men.





    “What we have here is a win,” said Parker’s wife, Andrea, joined by about 25 others outside the federal courthouse.
    All four men had been held without bail since early 2016.
    Acting U.S. Attorney Steven Myhre said prosecutors have not decided when they will retry Drexler and Parker on the remaining charges.
    Navarro scheduled Wednesday hearings for the two men, who were expected to be transferred to a federal halfway house in the meantime. The judge could decide tomorrow to release them from custody while prosecutors contemplate their next step.
    Chained at the ankles inside the courtroom late Tuesday afternoon, Parker and Drexler fist-bumped their attorneys, Jess Marchese and Todd Leventhal, before marshal’s escorted them back to a holding area.
    Parker still faces significant prison time for charges of assault and threatening a federal officer, along with underlying weapons charges. The jury also did not reach a verdict on assault and a weapons charge for Drexler.
    “I hope the government sees they have a weak case,” Parker’s lawyer, Marchese, said. “And I hope they decide to dismiss the remaining counts and save the taxpayers some money.”




    The potential for temporary freedom means Drexler could see his 6-month-old grandson for the first time, Leventhal said.
    During the second trial, U.S. District Judge Gloria Navarro barred the defense from referencing constitutional rights to freely assemble and to bear arms. She also prohibited mention of alleged misconduct or excessive force by law enforcement.
    Shortly after the verdict, defense attorneys spoke privately with jurors, who told them they had voted 11-1 in favor of acquittal on all charges.
    “This has been a long time coming,” the lawyer told reporters. “We knew it was going to happen eventually. As much as we were shut down to bring anything up, the jury saw through it.”
    During closing arguments last week, prosecutors pointed to social media posts in which the four men discussed the activities in the rural Nevada town, about 80 miles northeast of Las Vegas. On a video played for jurors, rancher Cliven Bundy spoke to a crowd outside his ranch, encouraging his followers to do what they needed to do to retrieve his cattle from the Bureau of Land Management.
    Defense attorneys for each of the men opted not to give closing statements.
    The defendants, charged as gunmen, were accused of driving from other states to Bunkerville in April 2014 to support Bundy, who is accused of conspiring to thwart the federal government’s roundup of roughly 1,000 cows from public land.
    Earlier this year, members of another jury declared that they were deadlocked on all counts against the four defendants but convicted two others.

  19. #259
    Senior Member Pablo's Avatar
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    A Federal Judge in Las Vegas has dismissed the case against the Bundy's.

    Bundy | LasVegasNow | KLAS-TV
    Progressive Liberalism is a mental disorder, time to M.A.G.A.

  20. #260
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    A further update
    The federal prosecutor in the Bundy case getting demoted into insignificance.

    Now I wonder what is happening to the Bureau of Land Management goons who precipitated this?

    Embattled federal prosecutor in Nevada takes a step down


    Updated April 12, 2018 - 5:17 pm


    After a stormy year, the long tenure of Steven Myhre as the No. 2 prosecutor in the Nevada U.S. attorney’s office has ended under secrecy.
    Within the past month, Myhre left his job as first assistant to Interim U.S. Attorney Dayle Elieson and took on new duties in the office as a senior litigation counsel, several former federal prosecutors who have spoken with office members told the Las Vegas Review-Journal.
    His new position comes with no supervisory responsibilities, but allows him to mentor and train younger attorneys, according to a Justice Department manual.
    Last May, Myhre, who spent about 15 years as first assistant in the office, was ordered to undergo anti-sex discrimination training as a result of a federal case filed by a female prosecutor during the tenure of former U.S. Attorney Greg Brower in 2008 and 2009.
    In January, Myhre came under fire again after Chief U.S. District Judge Gloria Navarro dismissed the high-profile criminal case against rancher Cliven Bundy and his co-defendants over the armed 2014 standoff near Bunkerville. Navarro concluded that Myhre’s prosecution team committed “flagrant” misconduct by not turning over evidence to the defense that could have harmed the government’s case. The Justice Department earlier had ordered an internal investigation of the prosecution team.

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